Bb Dizis

[edcat7]

Someone on the forum mentioned to me why not get a Bb dizi Previously it honestly hadn't crossed my mind. Is there music specifically composed for the Bb. If I do get one it will probably be at the budget end.

[xindi]

Oh my goodness! Not another flute! :/

Dizi Music comes in the following major keys/pitches: Low F, Low G, Low A, Low Bb, C, D, E, Eb F, G, A, Bb from low to high.

That's 12 dizi flutes If you decide to get doubles, that's 24 flutes
Or a wooden extra, which will be 36 dizi flutes :eek:

I only have low F/low G/D, C, E keys. Anything higher than the E really breaks my eardrums. The low Bb dizis I tried in China were all miserable quality around US$75. If you haven't mastered the low G, which is a similar bore size, you won't like the low Bb dizi either.

The higher pitched one sometimes has notation written with the double dots as standard pitch (you can play the low pitch, or high pitched Bb versions from jian pu, in key).
The 300 page Shanghai Publishing Co tome which holds all of the major Grade 5-9 pieces I have. I can't read the names, but I've just discovered that I've actually got '3 variations of a Plum Blossom' in it too. There are a few Bb pieces if you wish to have a look at them. They run into about 5 minutes of continuous playing lol

[davidmdahl]

A Bb dizi should not be that hard to play. The C dizi is a common choice for a beginner, and one step lower is not much more of a stretch. The low G dizi is a different story. I play a few tunes for Bb on erhu, but none for the ensemble I play in. I think that you might get a Bb dizi just for the fun of a lower sonority, without requiring a nasty stretch on the fingers. Remember, if you are playing by yourself, you can play the tunes you like on your favorite dizi, and the key doesn't matter.

Of course, if you want to play with other instrument in Bb, a Bb dizi will be very useful. <g>

Best wishes,

David

[edcat7]

I wanted to try a Bb because I was reminded of a jointless C DXH I had briefly. It was riddled with mold but because it was tuned very low for a C, I loved the tone. (Come to think of it, it was very long for a C.) I was concerned about the finger stretch.

I'd like to hear Flolei play some tunes on the Bb.,

[Flolei]

Hello, Ed!

I completely agree with David: Bb is closer to C than to low G. Actually I don't know tunes for Bb dizi, but plays some ehru pieces with it, like this one (I alreeady sent you the link, but anyway):

www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHPocmAf-AE

For me Bb is the best combinaison between light and darkness, if I can say things so. I get the same feeling when I listen to erhu.

Xindi, low Bb and low G are really very different. Low G is much thicker, so player needs much more air to blow it properly. I practice on this, but I'm improving very slowly. It is true that I bacame maybe a little lazy because I played D dizi constantly for a long time.

Have a nice day,

Flolei

[edcat7]

WOW!!! Flolei, that was fantastic!!!

I'm constantly telling Xindi not to influence me getting more instruments. I like the pipa and guzheng but not enough to learn it.

Right I'm getting a Bb, though it won't be before 7 July, the date of my performance.

Could you upload the score of that tune please?

Thanks

Ed

[Blue]

The jointless C DXH that I might give you has no mold. Should I also bring a cheap Bb along and give it to you as well? And a jointless mottled bamboo flute?

[Blue]

Maybe i should bring a xindi as well and see who in your community can master 11 holes.

[Flolei]

11 holes, Allen!... 10 hand fingers + one hole you close with your foot, or what?!

[Blue]

One hole you cover with the side of your hand!

Here's one picture
stmusic.anow.com.tw/showroom/view.php?C=5163082

Here's another picture:

And I accidentally stumbled upon plastic dizis when I was searching for pictures of xindi (not the Xindi we all know ;D )
wpfgen.taobao.com/

[edcat7]

Thanks Allen. I am very grateful for anything you bring over. I would like the dizis .....but I only need the books. I'll cook something better than Tiliapia when you come over!

[Blue]

And here's a plastic hulusi:
item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=10110504963

[edcat7]

I don't think much of those hulusis. My favourite one I cracked; also happens to be my cheapest one. Luckly for a cheap hulusi the tone is perfect.

[xindi]

A Bb dizi should not be that hard to play. The C dizi is a common choice for a beginner, and one step lower is not much more of a stretch. The low G dizi is a different story. I play a few tunes for Bb on erhu, but none for the ensemble I play in. I think that you might get a Bb dizi just for the fun of a lower sonority, without requiring a nasty stretch on the fingers. Remember, if you are playing by yourself, you can play the tunes you like on your favorite dizi, and the key doesn't matter.

Yes - no - yes - but - no - but - yes lol.

A low G is not hard to play - not for me since I play alto flute. Thing is - Ed smokes (*big hint to stop Ed!!*) so the phrasing problems with the longer/wider bore will be something to add, as well as the 2. instead of 5. being the base pitch.

Maybe it's all of the lower grade Bb dizis I've seen - it's not that US$75 is cheap: I think it's more to do with the longer the flute is, the harder it is to make (very well). The only ones I've seen are a good 6cm longer than a C dizi but the finger spread is more like the low G. The Xie Bing ones do look good (Eason) but I've never tried them. Perhaps they are more balanced, finger spread and length?

In any case, I didn't go for a dizi Bb - decided to defect and go Irish



You can see the length of the Irish Bb flute to the Irish D flute (although they start on different notes - the pitches are correct). The Bb dizis I played with were similar in length to the Irish Bb - maybe due to the thinner bamboo wall? In any case, this one is special, in that the finger holes are very closely approximated for smaller fingers.

I know classical players will say that the flute d'amore approximates more to a standard C flute (or D key) bore and playing ease than the alto flute proper (like the low G). But it's not that easy if you're short of puff lol.

'三，五，７', can be transposted to Bb using 6 (dot below) instead of C key.

春 ．茶 山 (sorry I can't read the second character) is a Bb piece，as is ' ．海 吹 歌' arrrgh. The third character has a 又 bit in front instead of the 口, and the first character I can't read, but it looks like something to do with water lollll!!

Not doing very well

[xindi]

May 21, 2012 14:53:48 GMT Blue said:

Maybe i should bring a xindi as well and see who in your community can master 11 holes.

Bring it on!!



One we grow hands like our feet, it won't be any challenge at all!




PS - nuts. There goes my broadband stalling from too many images...

[davidmdahl]

Xindi, you are complicating the issue by bringing Irish flutes into the discussion. A Bb dizi is at the same pitch as a F Irish flute, so you can't just mix and match the keys. A Bb Irish flute is essentially an old-pitch piccolo. Also complicating things is that a dizi has a cylindrical bore while the Irish flute has a conical bore. As a result the finger spacing is different between the two flute types.

When you compare flute lengths, it isn't the end-to-end measurement that counts. The dizi often has a lot of extra tube at each end that does not contribute to the sounding length. It is more useful to measure from the embouchure hole to the first vent hole past the finger holes.

When discussing the increased challenge of playing a lower flute, I am most concerned with the finger stretch, not the greater air. I still think that a Bb dizi is pretty comfortable to play. I much prefer playing Bb/C/D to the high G.

Best wishes,

David

[Flolei]

Xindi,

In my opinion, ´ºÂú²èɽ isn't a Bb piece, Bb is the tone, but the lowest note is C. It is actually a piece for F dizi. On this video, this nice young man plays it very well:
www.tudou.com/programs/view/kV0cxQlHHPM

I don't know the other piece you mentionned.

Well, I remember now that The Flying padridge is actually a Bb piece. Here we see how Chenyue played it when she performed in the UK:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJYoR5Wt71g

[edcat7]

Xindi

Do you have the scores for above for future reference.

Notice that even Chen Yue had to fine tune her dizi.

[Flolei]

Oups... Why Xindi can use Chinese characters and I can't! I meant the first piece mentionned.

[Blue]

Here's a conversion chart even though it was mean for a shinobue.
But it seems that the shinobue follows the western convention.
Ignore the 7th hole in the chart.

An "A" shinobue is a "D" dizi
A "F" shinobue is a "Bb" dizi

homepage2.nifty.com/iwatake/scale/real.html

[edcat7]

Whilst we're on the subject of long dizis is there music composed for a low G? Had one lying around untouched for a while and so decided to test the finger stretch. It not unmanageable.

[Flolei]

For low G there're a few very beautiful pieces. I have in mind:

- Autumn meditation at the dressing table
www.chaodikong.com/article/2007/0327/4152.html

- Moonlit lake in autumn
yuepu.huain.com/html/1046.html

- Reciting a poem on a clear night
www.ktvc8.com/article/article_47174_1.html

[edcat7]

Thanks Flolei, you're amazing!

I've only looked at the first one so far. Is that the whole score, it seems rather short?

Can you remind me what the last couple of fingers represent on a 7 holed G dizi.?

[Flolei]

It is the whole piece. It is about 5 mn of music. It seems short because it is slow and because the guzheng has solos (on this piece it is noticed only how many measures are empty for dizi).

The right hand of a 7 holes low dizi is very similar to the xiao one. All fingers are D, only three first are E, only two first are F and only the first one is F#.

[edcat7]

Thanks

so D is what number....
E "
F "
F# "