|
Post by YouLanFengChune on Jan 8, 2005 4:26:42 GMT
Hello!
I know Ying Ming Zhang (hangzhou linying dizi factory) personally.
He does have some good dizis, but i found them unsuitable for many pieces due to its tone. I would prefer Wang Yiliang's and Ng teck sengs.
Dong Xue Hua makes many good beijing dizis. Perhaps we can share more about our personal instruments?
|
|
|
Post by Dick on Jan 8, 2005 19:54:08 GMT
Hmmm... YouLanFengChune's negative comments are disappointing. Master Ying's factory is called JiaYin, not LinYing. The JiaYin workshop produces some of the best quality flutes in China. Do you really mean to disparage these fine flutes, or is it a misunderstanding?
Some people might feel it's inappropriate for you to claim shortcomings of flutes not sold by cadenza, especially without being specific. Technical details and concrete musical examples would help us understand your opinion. It would be even better if you could refer to objective evidence or authority. If you cannot, may we respectfully request that you confine future commentary to the positive and factual?
|
|
|
Post by davidmdahl on Jan 9, 2005 8:58:11 GMT
Hmmm... YouLanFengChune's negative comments are disappointing. <snip>Do you really mean to disparage these fine flutes, or is it a misunderstanding? My past experience with musicians and instruments is that people can have vastly different responses to the same instrument. What is positively golden to one can be nothing special to another. Add to this the individual nature of instruments (like bamboo flutes) that can vary from one to another quite a bit. I do find it useful and interesting to get a variety of opinions on instruments I am not in a position to test myself. One opinion may be useful by itself, but should not be considered authoritative. I enjoy sharing opinions and experiences, and certainly the more specific the better. This opinion is worth what you just paid to read it. Best wishes, David
|
|
|
Post by YouLanFengChune on Jan 9, 2005 15:29:58 GMT
Erm, Dick, sorry if i offended you, but really i must clarify.
I visit china on a part-time basis to study basics from Conservatoria. JiayIn (my mistake, LinYin is Hangzhou Dong Qiu Ming) dizis are the cheapest types where i live.
Perhaps I haven't seen muich of his instruments, and i have seen a few exceptional ones, but most of Ying Ming Zhangs instrumments, especially the batch which is black and is painted black, are sold for USD $40 each, and the intonation is horrid. I was forced to change an entire batch for my students. I have seen his very good dizis before, and of course they were good.
However, for people who can't choose, they have to rely on probability. I chose to believe a few makers cos i know them personally and i know their personal habits. Some makers would stamp their name indiscriminately, while some will have strict quality control over evey instrument thay make.
And if u want to that any qualitative answers on quality dizis, we should explore a list i posted in the previous posts, where i listed 10 criterias for a good instrument. Perhaps you could help me with my lists, and i'll enforece even stricter controls
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Huang on Jan 9, 2005 20:00:34 GMT
Guys, play nicely. I've just had an e-mail from CCN with a list of concerns about this forum, etc. Whilst I try to resolve this matter, the last thing I want is a misunderstanding on this turf.
Please.
|
|
|
Post by YouLanFengChune on Jan 25, 2005 14:54:44 GMT
Hiya!
After a bit of a arguement with Dick last time, which was resolved.
I just had a lesson with Dean of Shandong Music School, and he was using a REDWOOD dizi. As a gift, i gave him a Violet Bambo dizi, and we were commenting.
Perhaps Redwood Dizis are louder and brighter, but Bamboo ones certainly had more expansion and elastic abilities. Agre?
|
|
|
Post by Dick on Jan 25, 2005 16:13:44 GMT
One of my favorite xiaos is a beautiful rosewood piece signed by a maker called Guo from Guandong. I came across the instrument in a music shop on the street of wedding photographers in Taipei in March 2003. That trip, I had looked all over Taiwan for a nice flute, without success. The day before I was to leave, this shop keeper pulled out a few gold covered boxes containing these finely crafted flutes. The one I selected has a lustrous dark chocolate finish, with a mother of pearl dragon inlayed in the head joint. It responds like a dream, plays beautifully in pitch, with a loud rich tone.
Among my current working flutes I have also a xiao made by the legendary Feng of Beijing. This instrument is somewhat plain to look at at first, since Feng did not care to spend his energy engraving pretty calligraphy or even signatures on his flutes. His true signature is the captivating sound of his instruments. No one who hears mine can resist its delicate, almost reedy sound. It seems quiet when played solo, yet its distinct voice is easily heard above a chorus of singers.
My experiences with these, and several dozens of other flutes, has led me to believe that ultimately the material has more to do with the visual aesthetics of the instrument. Bamboo is pretty, and so can Chinese redwood, rosewood, and even ash be. As long as the material is stable and has reasonable acoustic properties, the final sound is likely depend most heavily on the way the material has been worked. Just my 2p.
|
|
|
Post by YouLanFengChune on Jan 25, 2005 16:19:57 GMT
Feng.. Feng Zi Cao (i may have forgotten the name)
He makes good dizis. I have 1 too..
Hmmm, If you go Taiwan, must find Lin GuZhen. Cadenza held his dizis for a few weeks, but it was too expensive to the international market.
Dick, are you coming Singapoire soon? I shall be making some dizis personally in May/June. If i do succeed, i'll send you 1 as a souvenior.
|
|
|
Post by Dick on Jan 29, 2005 19:57:32 GMT
Feng Hai Cheng is the Beijing craftsman I was talking about. He is very famous throughout China, for many years. Are you familiar with the expression "Bei Feng, Nan Dong"? Yes, that Feng. I know pinyin spellings can be variable from North to South, so maybe you are referring to the same maker. The information I have is that HC Feng retired from flute making a couple of years ago. He devotes himself to temple music now. His former apprentices are active crafting flutes in Tianjin.
Alas, we are not likely to visit Taiwan again for at least a couple of years. Our travel plans for this year are not entirely set yet. There is some chance of a visit to China in the fall, and we are talking about India for next winter. There is a very slight chance of jiggering the flight schedule to include a stop (less than a day) in Singapore. Or maybe we can figure out an inexpensive way to take a side trip.
I would be honored and delighted to check out your initial efforts at flutecraft. Would you be able to send one to Seattle, or are you thinking more about if/when we meet? Maybe we should work details of a transfer privately or via email.
|
|
|
Post by blob on Dec 20, 2005 16:15:45 GMT
Hi Everyone! Hmm Interesting that the last post of this topic was almost 1 year ago, well time for an update (Warning, going into uneccesarily long intro-mode now) Not too long since I started on the dizi (about 1 year now). Still learning, and without a teacher (hard to come by here in the UK), it has been a very interesting learning process. Now, don't laugh, but it took a good 6 months before I was able to sound all the 2 1/2 octaves on the dizi, and even then, it was pretty ear-piercing for the 3 highest notes. All whilst re-adjusting the embouchere, learning-re-learning how to stick the membrane properly, un-learning lots of bad-habits. I have a couple of dizis, but I mainly play on the one I got from CCN. I agree with comments that it is OKish (not great).. and they are a LOT more expensive than the original price in china ( I don't know if it is profit or shipment or both). I got the dizi from them, and decided I'd check out the source (www.xihudixiao.com).. and from the catalogue, I dunno, the Tangjun qiao dizi is 450 yuan, but they are saying in CCN that it is 450 dollars. Quite a mark up in price.. mine was the selected dizi, dunno if that was just the 150 yuan (high grade)(CCN price = 60 us dollars), or perhaps even shock horror the 45 yuan one (medium grade). Anyway, its blow-hole makes blowing more of a challenge, especially with 3rd octave notes, and the upper 2nd octave notes (more breath and embouchure control needed). I found this out when I went to china recently and got a more expensive "professional grade" dizi from nan yin dixiao (ok, not the best but well, it only cost about 20 UK pounds) . WIth this new dizi from nydixiao, blowing the high notes (erm.. third octave ones) was a lot easier and less shrill, a lot of other notes were a lot nicer sounding (lower ones more mellow, deeper), etc... but I learnt recently, that the above is still possible from the CCN dizi, only that its embochure is not so forgiving. HOWEVER, since I am still learning, I find that my tone still improves with practice with the CCN dizi, so, well, still far away before I "max out" any dizi from anywhere. I still use the CCN dizi now mainly because it requires me to work more, listen more, and learn more about breathing, tone etc. The other nydixiao one is a lot easier to blow in comparison, so I learn different things from it. But one thing I am doing now is to get my ears to listen to out-of-tuneness when playing the instrument (amazing how one doesn't notice this until we listen to our own recordings). Having more than 1 dizi for comparisons sometimes helps me here as well. Now, anyone know of a good dizi teacher in the UK? Ok.. anyway, just thought I'd introduce myself Cheers
|
|
|
Post by Dick on Dec 20, 2005 16:44:51 GMT
Welcome blob! We've been thinking the forum needs more wind players. Since I'm half the world away, sorry I can't offer advice about dizi teachers in UK, but hey maybe Charlie can direct you?
--Dick
|
|
|
Post by davidmdahl on Dec 20, 2005 21:44:42 GMT
Let me add my welcome as well, blob! I am spending more of my practice time on various Asian strings, but I have played a variety of flutes for years and still have a strong heart for the di. I have a self-study course for the di from Tim Liu of New York (www.2measures.com). I also bought my best di from Tim, and it is usually what I play, along with one I bought for $1 in Hanoi a few years ago. <g> You might consider Tim's course or he might even know of someone in the U.K.
Another possibility you might consider, is to ask around the classical or even Irish flutists in your area for some basic technical help. They may not know much about Chinese music or the di in particular, but many of the same rules apply. The Irish flute is six holed as well, so the finger technique is somewhat similar, even though the ornamentation is not quite the same. The mechanics of breathing, embouchure, and posture that you could learn from a good open-minded classical flute teacher could really save you a lot of trouble.
Tim Liu was a guest at the latest convention of the British Flute Society, so you might contact them for information on Chinese flutists in the U.K. Trevor Wye, a very successful and prolific teacher, performer, and arranger, might be worth contacting as well. I don't know that he knows very much about Chinese music, but if you are lucky enough to get a lesson with Trevor, it would be an unforgettable experience, in the best sense. Trevor knows so many people in music, that I would be surprised if he could not at least refer you to someone.
Good luck.
Best wishes,
David
|
|
|
Post by blob on Dec 20, 2005 22:40:59 GMT
Thanks for the advice. I have been seriously considering getting the tutorial from Tim, but it is pretty steep in price for me at least (no doubt most probably very good). I might eventually get it though, if I can convince Mrs Blob first What do you think of the quality for Tim's course? I have been considering getting an irish flute too, but for now will need to settle for the pvc (doug tipple seems a very good one), as even the cheapest conical bores cost a lot, and yes, I think irish flutists are more common than dizi teachers here in the UK. And yes, a teacher would most probably set right quite a few wrongs which might otherwise take me days or even weeks to figure out, let alone rectify. But nonetheless, self teaching has its rewards though, especially when one discovers a solution to different problems Thanks everyone! Blob
|
|
|
Post by davidmdahl on Dec 20, 2005 23:06:33 GMT
I did the self-learning approach with at least two instruments over the past twenty or so years. I did progress somewhat on my own, but my accomplishment and enjoyment once I started regular lessons vastly outstripped that of the go-it-alone period. I find that my teachers challenge me in ways I could or would not do, left to my own devices. There is still plenty of room for self-discovery and problem-solving, but I tend to waste less time banging my head against the wall, and more time making music.
I take weekly lessons on two instruments, the erhu and Vietnamese monochord (dan bau). In both cases, I look forward to the next lesson immediately after the previous one. I consider lessons a gift to myself.
Best wishes,
David
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Huang on Dec 21, 2005 0:47:11 GMT
Don't know much dizi players here in Blighty, except for a man from my neck of the woods in Brum called Max. Sadly, we've lost contact with each other for some reason beyond myself. He is a really good dizi player.
My advice would be to join the summer school in July next year in London, though I'm slightly iffy about whether dizi will be on this year. We'll have to wait and see. In the meantime, you should listen to David-san's advice. Or you can contact Cheng Yu as she will have many links to Chinese musicians resident in the UK.
|
|
|
Post by sanmenxia on Dec 21, 2005 0:57:09 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Huang on Dec 21, 2005 12:46:36 GMT
Avoid Rayman music! They don't have very good wares as I discovered from my circle of musical friends!
The UK Chinese Music Ensemble is Cheng Yu's domain and as I said, your first point of call is to contact her for info.
UK China Music Promotions is also good to find teachers. I'm already preparing to be listed as an artist musician there (got my CV and photos prepared and everything).
|
|
|
Post by sanmenxia on Dec 21, 2005 18:59:19 GMT
Err…speaking from personal experience ;D most of Ray Man’s instruments are of a entry/basic level, some are a bit better but not really the top grade, I think they’re all standard factory production line stuff. Obviously the prices are a lot higher than in China. If you’re in or passing through London, it’s an interesting place just to go and have a look around as they all have sorts of instruments from Asia and Africa. I only mention them as they might know a dizi teacher.
|
|
|
Post by blob on Dec 21, 2005 21:13:05 GMT
Thanks for all the useful information and advice , I may contact some of the people in the above links as well. I will also keep an eye out for the summer school, and if they do a dizi class this year. I was tempted to go to this year's dizi class, but dunno, I wasn't very sure whether they actually do beginners, so I thought I'd work myself up to some level slightly above beginner first, at least to the level where I can do a few intermediate pieces.
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Huang on Dec 22, 2005 1:04:41 GMT
The classes are for beginners as well! Of course, it would be an advantage if you can read tablature, but that's not essential to learn.
|
|
taogirl
Novice
I'm an absoflute fanatic!
Posts: 1
|
Post by taogirl on Jan 20, 2006 7:06:19 GMT
G'day everyone. I've recently purchased a basic beginner's Dizi (Dunhuang key of C) from Ebay, and was wondering if anyone could direct me to any good self-taught manuals for a humble beginner like me. I live in Australia and the info, dizi accessories, etc... Are far and few. Also, where does one go to buy dimo reed and bai chie? Cheers!
|
|
|
Post by blob on Jan 20, 2006 19:53:57 GMT
Welcome taogirl! Hmm.. I recalled somewhere in this forum of some beginner information for blowing the dizi. Additional areas are those for irish flutes, which is somewhat similar, well at the start anyway. but then, there are pretty important aspects of the dizi such as pasting the dimo, where there are actually a large amount of information, but they are all in chinese as far as I know (mainly in various chinese bbs), not all good, but there are lots anyway. dimo ... ahhh.. errr.. I am not sure about Australia, but here in the UK, I have given up. I usually get some friends to order it from some dizi factories in china (e.g. www.zhuyun.com, www.jiayinyueqi.com, etc..), since they do not really cater for overseas purchase, and even if they did, they don't use paypal, and any form of international money transfer costs too much. You could try cadenza (candenzamusic.biz) perhaps? They are based in singapore and might stock them. Perhaps there might be some chinse music shops in Australia, but not sure.. And for pasting, you can either use a-jiao or bai chie .. I think both should be available at your local chinese medicine shop, definately a-jiao anyway. Good luck, learning the dizi is very interesting and challenging, and I have still a LOONNG way to go too Hope this helps!
|
|
|
Post by davidmdahl on Jan 20, 2006 23:47:55 GMT
Dizi supplies, including reed membrane and paste, can be ordered through Cadenza (www.cadenzamusic.biz) and Tim Liu in New York (http://www.2measures.com/products.html). I purchased a dizi and learning materials from Tim, and am very happy. It is relatively expensive, but worth the cost if you don't have access to a teacher. The course materials are in English and scores in both jianpu and staff notation are included.
Best wishes,
David
|
|
Cheetoe
Novice
New Kid on the Block!
Posts: 3
|
Post by Cheetoe on Feb 19, 2014 5:54:49 GMT
My name is Chi, I have recently just begun quite an interest in a Dizi. Probably start out with a Qudi type in key of D. Nice to meet everyone!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 19, 2014 8:00:59 GMT
Hi everyone,
I found this forum yesterday, and since I've been playing the dizi off and on for the past 10 years, I thought it would be a nice place to discuss problems and advice.
I started off in a school Chinese Orchestra with a Bandi (G flute), occasionally switching to the Qudi (D flute) for certain pieces. I personally prefer the Bandi, but it maybe because the Qudi requires much more air (and my hands are small so it's harder to stretch them). I have also played on dizis with other keys (recently was F flute and E flute).
Lately, I have been learning on my own with some solo pieces that my teacher from school gave me. I also try to transcribe Western pieces that I like into jianpu notation, but it's not always easy.
Anyways, nice to meet you all!
|
|