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Post by dsouthwood on Mar 23, 2006 4:53:57 GMT
In another thread on this forum, maaltan wrote that he had gotten a "new 'high end' bridge from cadenza." I can't find any bridges on their web site at all.
My questions are:
What makes a bridge "high end"?
How can I purchase one?
Forgive me if this has been discussed elsewhere.
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Post by YouLanFengChune on Mar 23, 2006 5:10:49 GMT
Hi...
The bridges are handcrafted in batches and there's not much for international orders. Hence,to order, please email at sales@cadenzamusic.biz
The bridges are made out of 30-year old maple boards, reserved for making violins. The optimal density is between 720-750kg/m3. The secret lies with the carving acton of the making.
The bridges costs USD$4 each, seeming expensive, but i tend to think of the $4 as buying a brighter, clearer sound, not just a piece of wood
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Post by davidmdahl on Mar 23, 2006 8:54:14 GMT
I bought a few of the new hard maple bridges along with a recent order of bows. I have to admit that I was skeptical that there would be a noticable difference, but the difference was quite obvious, and in a pleasing way. There is a smooth clarity that I didn't hear before. It may depend on the erhu how much of an effect there is.
Best wishes,
David
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Post by YouLanFengChune on Mar 23, 2006 11:16:33 GMT
The bridges may not be THE MOST suitable. 1 Conservatorium Lecturer acquired 30 from me recently at USD price (hey, it was made in Singapore), and he decided that only thru tial and error, the BEST fit can be found. He used 9 for his 9 erhus, 21 were used by his student.
1 observation: May not be suitable for extremely new erhus. The sound tends to be very sharp....
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Post by Charlie Huang on Mar 23, 2006 14:51:12 GMT
The bridges costs USD$4 each, seeming expensive, but i tend to think of the $4 as buying a brighter, clearer sound, not just a piece of wood Oh come on! That's hardly considered expensive! 2 quid is cheap as chips!
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Post by maaltan on Mar 23, 2006 18:40:03 GMT
This erhu hobby has already chained into me learning several other skills. I decided I wanted to try to carve a bridge. All I had was semi dull xacto knives. BTW that doesn't work very well when carving oak. So I got a set of carving chisels. Well they were horribly dull. i could rest the weight of my arm on the 45deg angle chisel without breaking the skin. I was informed that almost no tools (worth having) come pre sharpened since the use dictates the technique needed to sharpen them. I am learning about sharpening blades with all the angles and minutae involved there-in. well to get back on subject. I have carved one that is smaller (thinner) than the cadenza one I got. I also carved a pretty large one. It was about double the size of the cheapys that came with mine and about 4x the size of te cadenza one. Each one has its own flavor and would probably have its own purpose in specific songs/situations. Some observations I have made. The taller the bridge the more pronounced the imperfections of technique/instruments. The tallest were the ones that came with mine and my cheap erhu almost BARKs when you start a note. According to spectrum analysis, at the start of notes that are exact harmonics of the open string, the volume is magnified horribly for a splitsecond creating white noise for that period. The shorter the bridge the smoother things are but I seem to lose volume. The larger the head/bridge contact area the more the lower notes seem to be smoothed and mellowed out and easier to control. Unfortunately, you lose clarity or even the ability to play the higher notes. The smaller the contact area, the brighter and clearer the notes are. Also, it is harder to control the tones of the notes. you can hear every variation of bow pressure and fingering pressure with the tiny bridge I made. i have not done any manipulations of weight so i dont know how that may affect my observations. The cadenza is a good mid-ground model for the beginner. gives you a good sound without being too demanding. These are only my observations from my very limited experience. I have only been playing for about 2 months now. I hope to make some other shapes and sizes out of oak. i also plan trying to make some out of plastic, paper, and possibly glass if I can figure out how to get it into shape. A 4 inch long by 3/8 inch glass test tube used as a bridge makes the wierdest sounds, not at all objectional either. Similar to a therman, yet unique. Try at your own risk, I was expecting the tube to shatter at any second. well in short, the bridge makes a big difference in the sound, but don't be afraid to be creative.
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Post by calden on Mar 23, 2006 18:51:05 GMT
My friend here who plays dizi and yangqing with me also plays erhu. An engineer by training, he is a ceaseless tinkerer and has made a bridge for his erhu from the barrel of a ball point pen. Not just any pen, mind you, but a certain brand and model (can't remember what that is....) It's a short piece (~1/2" long) slid under the strings, length of barrel at 90 degree angle to the strings.
He has it cut so, viewed as though you are holding the erhu horizontally level and sticking straight out from your eye, looking at the tail end, it slopes in as it goes from the head to the top.
This has made his erhu loud and somewhat more nasal, which is saying a lot for an erhu. I have to really saw away to keep up with him. He's advocated I install such a bridge but I won't do it - the sound when playing by myself is atrocious.
Carlos
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Post by maaltan on Mar 23, 2006 20:07:08 GMT
hmm almost tried that, but i oculdnt find an acceptable pen i wanted to "sacrifice"
I would assume is a basic white bic stick pen barrel. I think the most common has blue ink. They have the plainest barrel, just a simple white polystyrene (i think, maybe polyproplyene) tube.
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Post by dsouthwood on Mar 24, 2006 2:17:02 GMT
Thanks, everybody, for all the information. I'll certainly try the violin maple bridge.
maaltan, although glass would indeed be difficult to shape, high-fired porcelain would have similar properties and would be child's play to form into various bridges. If you don't know a potter, check your community colleges for classes and talk to one of the instructors. Could be an interesting experiment.
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Post by YouLanFengChune on Mar 24, 2006 4:50:50 GMT
Calden!!
What ur friend has done was done 10 yrs back by meastro chen Yaoxin, on oval Erhu and pencil oactagoal bridge, used to mimic nasal singing....
hehehehe
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Post by maaltan on Mar 24, 2006 15:21:57 GMT
Thanks, everybody, for all the information. I'll certainly try the violin maple bridge. maaltan, although glass would indeed be difficult to shape, high-fired porcelain would have similar properties and would be child's play to form into various bridges. If you don't know a potter, check your community colleges for classes and talk to one of the instructors. Could be an interesting experiment. hmm forgot that. i dont have any porcelin clay (im not even sure its special). I used to have a ball of regular ceramic clay... somewhere I do have some polymer clay that i will add to my list . I can use that to make a mold for my plastic casting resin. That way I dont have to risk destroying my good wood one with the latex/ammonia/plaster treatment. Also, Does the hole in the bridge do anything other than lighten it so its more responsive to higher frequencies? I have been omitting the hole in my models.
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Post by dsouthwood on Mar 25, 2006 1:26:54 GMT
I have wondered what the hole is for. If it is there to reduce the mass of the bridge, what would happen if the hole were offset toward the A string so that there was less mass for the higher frequencies and more mass for the lower frequencies? Or two holes of different diameters? If you are in an experimenting mood....
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Post by maaltan on Mar 25, 2006 2:37:15 GMT
i was thinking of trying 2 bridges .. a tiny one for the a string and a larger one for d. A preliminary test with 2 regular ones though has shown that the one on the non-active string rattles creating horrible notes.
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Post by dsouthwood on Apr 15, 2006 0:03:57 GMT
I just received my violin maple bridges from Cadenza. My erhu now has a much smoother sound from the D string without sacrificing any quality from the A string.
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Post by YouLanFengChune on Apr 17, 2006 1:02:00 GMT
Hehe...
i'll be making another batch soon. Its rather pleasing. weirdly, densty above 0.8 sounds HORRID. Zitarn, Dalbergia (ebony Sandalood) makes the erhu sounds squueky
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Post by damien on Aug 14, 2006 23:56:44 GMT
Don't take my word for it but from what i have read White Wood gives a brighter tone, Ebony bridge will give a more mellow tone, rosewood gives a sharper but rounder tone and Bridges made from Violet Sandalwood gives richer tone to the instrument. But as i have not heard these in practise it could be bogus information.
And i hope your wrong YouLanFengChune because i have just purchased some ebony bridges haha but it's got to be better than the crap cut white wood bridges i have now.
Maybe depending on what everything else is made of on your instrument depends what outcome the sound of the bridge will make?
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Post by damien on Aug 15, 2006 14:57:44 GMT
Does it matter what material you use for dampening under the bridge?
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Post by davidmdahl on Aug 15, 2006 16:29:37 GMT
I find that there are differences from one bridge to another even made of the same material and design. Shape matters also. I have tried several varieties but returned to the button shaped dark bridge that came with my erhu. The "best" probably depends on the nature of the particular erhu, skin tightness, and the taste of the player. If the erhu already has a tendency toward brightness, a bridge that did not emphasize this might be a better choice.
We have discussed the dampener before but I don't remember which thread to quote. My erhu came with a felt dampener that works well, so I have not experiemented with other materials. It would be among the easiest and cheapest tests to make on the erhu, particularly if you have a friend or family member who sews. It does matter a lot how close the dampener is to the bridge and how much pressure is put on the skin.
Best wishes,
David
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Post by damien on Sept 4, 2006 13:43:18 GMT
Right! who warned me about bridges made of ebony hahaa
It really does drain the sweetness and sharpness out of your Erhu.
NEVER BUY EBONY BRIDGES!!!
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Post by maaltan on Sept 5, 2006 1:35:18 GMT
hmm i need to remember that. I was just wondering how you make an erhu sound agressive and raw (when needed). Sweet and light comes naturally with my new erhu. Of course, unless you plan on playing Metal on the erhu (which i am attemting ) i dont forsee a raw agressive sound needed for an entire sound. Therefore it must be doable with bowing.
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Post by damien on Sept 7, 2006 19:40:23 GMT
Metal sounds interesting lol maybe get an electric Erhu. Well i have been informed in another thread that different bridges for different erhus makes different sounds. It made mine sound dull. Explore the possibilities i say, heck make your own.
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Post by damien on Sept 13, 2006 22:47:32 GMT
Ok My white wood bridge is sounding aweful because it is cut so badly so i replaced it with my new ebony wood bridge and yes it sounds drained abit but i don't think ebony so bad after all, atleast they are cut properly.
I wish somewhere offered a mix of different bridges in one bag.
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Post by maaltan on Sept 14, 2006 4:13:34 GMT
Electric erhu .. i already researched it. They DO make them. i saw one picture i cant find again. basically replace the resonator box with a sitck and a plate with electronics in the plate. I also dissasembled my cheap microphone and place it under the strings instead of a bridge. It actually worked quite well Tapping on the head only made a slight sound on the computer and playing came through really clear. Then again im not an audiophile therefore im sure someone could take the recording and pick it to pieces .. but for the untrained ear it was pretty good. Then again theres always pre- and post-amp filters i could apply. (hmm wah-wah petal hmmm)
Also just remembered one of my "substitute" bridges i tested. Use a plastic 3/16" tube that flexes moderately that covers the head as you would a "mute" stick. Again, remove the bridge for this. It has a etheral whiny sound similar to some wierd pink floyd or 80's synth music. I must revist this again someday and see if i can make practical music with it.
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Post by damien on Nov 22, 2006 19:06:18 GMT
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Post by calden on Nov 22, 2006 22:15:48 GMT
Thanks for pointing this out. I just ordered the set.
Carlos
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