new erhu bow has too much hair!

[Anyet]

Just got first new replacement erhu bow, and the stick etc. look great, but there is actually too much hair--very thick and makes it so cannot keep separate from the two strings while playing. Has anyone had this problem or found a way to adjust bow hair? I actually put old bow back on again. Should I just randomly snip hairs to make the hunk thin? The piece at the frog end of the bow out on the hair is too thick too because of all the extra hair. Grrr--was really looking forward to this upgrade. HELP!

[davidmdahl]

Welcome to the forum Anyet. I would not advise cutting bow hair, but you might contact the vendor see if they have suggestions. In this situation, I would prefer to use a bridge where the string grooves are further apart. If you have several bridges, this is easy to try. Depending on where the grooves are now, you might be able to cut new grooves. This might not be what you want to do if you only have one bridge.

Different styles of bow will have more or less hair. Maybe you can check with a violin maker/repairer since rehairing a bow is a needed skill for that profession. That way the hair could be thinned out without causing problems. Might you have received a zhonghu bow by mistake?

Best wishes,

David

[Anyet]

Thanks David--I will check to see if we have extra bridges already, plus we recently ordered the fancy schmanzy petrified wood from Eason. This particular bow came from ebay-LA area I believe and is a described 'Artist Quality' bow, slightly longer for easier sustained notes etc, but def an erhu bow. It was their top level bow, around $35 plus shipping. My hubby is the player-grew up in China playing . We have a luthier close by and may take this bow to him to "dehair". He is also Chinese, but would find the request amusing I would guess. Was a real disappointment at how thick the hank of hair was as we were hoping at improved sound quality on our erhu.

[davidmdahl]

Regarding the bridge made supposedly of 4000 year old wood, I have one that came on a higher-end erhu that I bought several years ago from Eason. I am not quite as impressed with it as Sung Wah. I wound up replacing it with a white wood bridge, and lately am using Chinese Red Pine (Pinus tabulaeformis). These red pine bridges really sound good on my erhus. I did sand the base down a bit to reduce the height. New bridges are often too tall, and result in a harsh tone. Even a little taken off makes a big difference, so it is important to go slowly.

As with strings, a bridge needs to match the erhu, so a bridge might sound good on one erhu and not so much on another. Your old wood bridge may be perfect for your husband's erhu.

[Anyet]

We are finding dealing with erhu such fun after years of cello and the related expenses. I saw that Eason has several really nice erhu for sale coming from Tianjin--we will try to scout that maker out in person if possible while we are there.

[edcat7]

I don't think a bow having too much hair is a problem. More of a problem is when the hair is bunched rather than laid flat.

I've been using a recommended Eason bow for a while and have come to love it.

I ordered this bow, E0433 with a rather dearish pipa for a fiend, hence I didn't have to pay for postage for the bow.

www.redmusicshop.com/Accessories/Bows/Professional%20Erhu%20Bow,%20Chinese%20violin%20bow,%20E0433

The RMS bow is thicker, heavier with a lot of hair (laid flat). I find with this bow I can be very light handed. I'm at the moment practising the erhu quivalent of double tongueing on the dizi, along in time with a metronome. Just slight moments of the wrist are needed.

I compare using a bow to using a fountain pen; once you're comfortable with one you're unlikely to change to another. So to compare bows is difficult.

[davidmdahl]

Jul 2, 2013 18:41:07 GMT edcat7 said:

I don't think a bow having too much hair is a problem. More of a problem is when the hair is bunched rather than laid flat.

A couple of years ago when performing in Canada, I borrowed an erhu rather than risk one of my own in an international trip. The borrowed erhu was very frustrating to play. One of the problems was a very bushy bow while the string grooves on the bridge were relatively close together. At the time, I didn't feel enabled to cut new grooves. It was very hard to play just one note. The angle had to be just right, or I would bow both strings.

I have considered getting an erhu for travelling, so that I can at least have something to take along that is not too precious. As it happened, last weekend I saw a very cheap erhu priced at $35 at a local Asian decor store. It was bad enough that I decided to pass. The weight was like balsa wood. It might be okay to scratch out a tune on, but probably not for performing. It might be a interesting contest though. Who has the cheapest playable/listenable erhu?

Best wishes,

David

[edcat7]

I noticed when playing my gaohu, I also sometimes touched both strings when bowing. I too suspected that the bow hairs were too thick. Then I asked my teacher and he played it and there was none of both strings touching. He explained that my fingers weren't putting enough tension in the strings. I'm not saying Anyet's bow hairs aren't too thick but perhaps in most cases it's down to the bowing.

[davidmdahl]

Ed, I don't understand how the pressure of the fingers on the strings has anything to do with playing both strings with the bow. When this happens to me, it is usually because I am getting lazy and the angle of my bow to the strings is off. If the bow is as perpendicular as possible to the snake skin, the angle is probably correct, and I am not playing both strings. This is assuming that the bridge spaces the strings wide enough to accommodate the thickness of the bow hair.

Best wishes,

David

[edcat7]

Yes, you're probably right. My gaohu and LLS erhu are quite light and the angles do slip. I solved that problem by resting them on a chamois leather...until I mislaid it.

On another note: I've been using Denis's excellent erhu fingering chart for your "Stranger in Paradise" jianpo. I've only practised the first page and was surprised at how easy it is to play. Thanks.

[Minh]

Hey edcat,
where can I find that jianpu of Stranger in Paradise? It sounds interesting.

[edcat7]

David,

Can you give it to Minh please. I'm not sure how to transfer it from email to here. Thanks.

[davidmdahl]

I have long since deleted the photos off Stranger in Paradise from my cell phone, so I will need to find the sheets on which I wrote the jianpu. You might save me a little time by emailing the scans back to me, Ed. Otherwise, I will find time sometime this week.

Best wishes,

David

[Minh]

It's fine if it's too much trouble, it was never in my plans to learn that song right now anyway, I just thought it was very lovely If you can or find it, yay, if not, don't put effort into it.

[davidmdahl]

Minh, I sent you the scans that Ed emailed back to me.

Best wishes,

David

[Minh]

I got them! Thank you again. Since we are on a erhu bow hair topic, i'll just stir it back to the right topic, my erhu hair lost so many hair now it is thin, which is nice. I remember I was struggling with a new hairful bow, but I'm now not sure if it was because it was thick or because I was still very new at it. Have any of you tried both of the shanghai and beijing type of bows? Are they different much or just the frog is attached?

[truckbuddha]

Oct 18, 2013 1:50:07 GMT Minh said:

I got them! Thank you again. Since we are on a erhu bow hair topic, i'll just stir it back to the right topic, my erhu hair lost so many hair now it is thin, which is nice. I remember I was struggling with a new hairful bow, but I'm now not sure if it was because it was thick or because I was still very new at it. Have any of you tried both of the shanghai and beijing type of bows? Are they different much or just the frog is attached?

Hi Minh,

Yes I have both, and yes each one is different.  The hair on a Shanghai bow is round and fuller, it has more strands, while the Beijing bow is flat with less hair.  There is only a slight difference in the number of hairs.  I thought the one had 86 while the other maybe had 80 or 82, I am not sure actually now, it was a while ago when I read that somewhere.

And perhaps even the actual number of hairs could differ between the different makers.

But going back to what David said earlier, I did notice on my one bridge, how the strings are spaced a little further a part, so perhaps getting the right bridge spacing is even more important than what kind of bow we use.

Since I am so new myself, I can't comment on a preference in which bow to use.  I am sure it must in time be an individual choice thing. 

love and light to you Minh,

don

[truckbuddha]

Minh,

Minh if you want, I could send you my unused bow from my damaged and messed up LLS. Its a flat Beijing bow, just PM me your address and I'll be happy to send it to you. But I travel where my job takes me, and I won't be home maybe for several more weeks, so it will take a while, but still, its yours if you want it.

don

[Minh]

Oh, well that is very nice, thank you. I sent you a private message.

[edcat7]

A Yin Shi bow was included with my HHR and I suspect since Anyet is a professional cellist she has the same bow. Mine too was touching both strings and for ages I struggled along with it. Now after several months it plays just fine. I particularly like it being a lot longer than my other bows. My teacher likes it because the bow hair is wider than other bows.

[edcat7]

My new teacher says I play the D string when I play the A string not the other way round. She says it's the angles and don't put enough forward pressure. I also think that loosening the bow further helps a bit. I also notice this tends to happen towards the tip of the bow.