Beginner Pipa and Jianpu question - confused!!

[kuduchi]

I went to my first pipa lesson with a teacher and I was surprised about how much I could learn in just one hour. I also brought a Pipa textbook from my teacher and just a few days I was making heads or tails of it until I figured out some key things (fret positions, etc). You guys were right, a teacher is necessary for this instrument. There are a number of things that my teacher taught me that I would have never guess!

First question: The Pipa tuning is ADEA but my teacher said something about D major (or D minor? Im not sure) so when Im going through the exercises, the notes are not what they seem to be, I have to pretend as if Im playing another scale. Why is this? For example:

First string pressed, first finger is originally E but according to my teacher and textbook, it's actually D. To explain it better, open strings are ADEA but my teacher (and reference to textbook) says I have to look at it as: GCDG. Why is this so?

Second question: I am going back to school very soon and will not be able to attend lessons. Is it possible to learn something by myself? I already started doing the second exercise by myself because I know the first exercise already (Im very anxious to learn the pipa!! ;D )

Third question: My teacher put some pipa nail tape on certain frets to mark the different positions. Thanks to my textbook, it also marks the positions too. If I begin on the 2nd position, is the fingering (and method of holding the instrument, and fingering the frets) the same as in the 1st position? What about for 3rd and 4th? I'm disappointed that the first few practice songs are European and American folk songs that Im familiar with..I want to play Chinese music not Western music

Fourth (and last) question: Does the Pipa use chords (like guitar chords)? Because I see youtube videos of people playing with all types complicated finger positions. Or are they using some fingers to support the instrument? If I recall a video of Wu Man, she says that chords arent used..but only used for rock and if playing pipa with Western pop music or something. Sometimes, when I do the exercises, certain fingers are used to support the weight of the instrument only. Is this the case?

Anyway, I really love this instrument ;D

[davidmdahl]

Congratulations on your first lesson, Kuduchi. You already know more about playing the pipa than me, so I am not in any position to give advice. You might check with your teacher to see if lessons can be provided over the Internet with Skype or Messenger. Even email or advice by phone might be worthwhile.

I understand your concern about playing non-Chinese tunes, but this is often a good way to get started.

Best wishes,

David

[sanmenxia]

First question: The Pipa tuning is ADEA but my teacher said something about D major (or D minor? Im not sure) so when Im going through the exercises, the notes are not what they seem to be, I have to pretend as if Im playing another scale. Why is this? For example:

First string pressed, first finger is originally E but according to my teacher and textbook, it's actually D. To explain it better, open strings are ADEA but my teacher (and reference to textbook) says I have to look at it as: GCDG. Why is this so?

AFAIK jianpu doesn't work like that. A written note in jianpu, ie a numbers, indicates a note's position in the diatonic major scale, not to a note of a specific pitch like in Western notation. For example:

1 2 3 4

is

1st note, 2nd note, 3rd note and 4th note in the diatonic major scale.

So in the key of D (1=D), the open strings are written as 5 1 2 5 (ignoring octaves dots).

If the key is G, then the open strings are written as 2 5 6 2.

In both cases the actual notes are still A D E A.

I think the problem might have something to do with difference between the "fixed" and "movable" do systems. When you say "first finger is originally E but according to my teacher and textbook, it's actually D", I think your teacher and book says it's re, or "2" on the page, both meaning the 2nd note in the scale, which is E in the key of D, and which is the note played.

In some countries "re" actually means the note D, this is the fixed do system where do re mi etc actually means notes of specific pitches i.e. C D E etc. For example Beethoven's Violin Concerto in D major is called Beethoven's Violin Concerto in re major in some European countries.

[wanwan]

Aug 26, 2011 21:47:39 GMT kuduchi said:

Second question: I am going back to school very soon and will not be able to attend lessons. Is it possible to learn something by myself? I already started doing the second exercise by myself because I know the first exercise already (Im very anxious to learn the pipa!! ;D )

Third question: My teacher put some pipa nail tape on certain frets to mark the different positions. Thanks to my textbook, it also marks the positions too. If I begin on the 2nd position, is the fingering (and method of holding the instrument, and fingering the frets) the same as in the 1st position? What about for 3rd and 4th? I'm disappointed that the first few practice songs are European and American folk songs that Im familiar with..I want to play Chinese music not Western music

Fourth (and last) question: Does the Pipa use chords (like guitar chords)? Because I see youtube videos of people playing with all types complicated finger positions. Or are they using some fingers to support the instrument? If I recall a video of Wu Man, she says that chords arent used..but only used for rock and if playing pipa with Western pop music or something. Sometimes, when I do the exercises, certain fingers are used to support the weight of the instrument only. Is this the case?

Anyway, I really love this instrument ;D

Hi - glad you love the pipa.
to your 2nd question - \
It's possible to learn things by yourself - of course it's better to learn from a teacher if you want to learn Ambush from All Side. But if its just finger exercise for beginners - go ahead (it helps sight-reading too). If you are still taking lesson, it would be helpful to show your teacher what u learned by urself and see if he/she would correct you. A lot of beginners tend to pluck with their fingers only and forget about the wrist - so its always better to have a teacher to look at your playing.

3. Both third and fourth position cover more notes than the first and second position because the distances between notes there are shorter. In third position, your pinky will usually be used for any notes between 16-18 frets

4. We do play chords on the pipa, but its very rarely that we do so:
a. Chinese music is mostly based on pentatonic scale (there are Chinese music that uses other scales too), so you won't have a C->F->G7->C progression
b. Pipa maybe louder than guitar, but it doesn't sustain as long as the guitar does - the volume drops very rapidly after you pluck the strings. So often we see the pipa as a melodic instrument.

As long as the instrument is not falling (make sure its not sliding on your trousers), we generally use as less energy as possible to support the weight of the instrument. The harder you grab on the fingerboard - the more difficult your hand moves on the fingerboard.

Hope this helps

[sanmenxia]

open strings are ADEA but my teacher (and reference to textbook) says I have to look at it as: GCDG. Why is this so?

The open string are sol do re sol, in the key of D, ie 1=D=do. This is the movable do naming system where "do" is the first note in the major diatonic scale and can be of any pitch.

The other do naming system is where do re mi... are just another name for C D E... ie "do" is always C, "re" is always E etc.

"ADEA" is 5125 in the key of D, sol do re sol in movable "do". But in fixed "do", sol do re sol is just another name for GCDG.

[xindi]

Just wondering what happened to all the pipa players.....?

Seems like I joined the party late. Rather than add another thread - I wondered if any alternative open string tunings
were commonly used?

I love its chromatic potential. I have a lot of questions after having a few lessons, but mostly will be spending the next six months practicing the two main right handed techniques before I even attempt to try to read the jian pu.