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woods
Oct 20, 2005 19:26:57 GMT
Post by spansar on Oct 20, 2005 19:26:57 GMT
I have a few questions regarding erhu wood:
Wondering if anyone could elaborate on the tonality of different woods e.g. does sandalwood have a radically different tone than rosewood? What are historical reasons why these woods are used?
Pertaining to erhu, is "ebony" really ebony, or something else?
Typically, do erhu have finished wood? What are common finishing processes?
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woods
Oct 20, 2005 21:03:32 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Oct 20, 2005 21:03:32 GMT
Welcome to our forum, spansar! You have good questions. I am a relative greenhorn when it comes to erhu, so you might want to take my comments with a grain of salt.
Those I know who have a lot of experience with erhus tend to believe that different woods have different qualities of sound. The higher-end erhus tend to be of a variety of sandalwood, such as golden or violet. I have what was sold to me as a Ebony Sandalwood erhu from Cadenza Music. Mid-level models are usually of redwood, and entry-level models are often of redwood or pear wood. It is difficult to know how much the wood matters since from one instrument to another we are comparing more than the wood. The skin, strings, bridge, and setup of the erhu are also very important, and may in fact be more important. The quality of the particular wood may actually be more important than the variety. For example, a poor quality of sandalwood with lots of knots may be not be as good as high quality redwood.
The better erhus I have played were made of sandalwood, and had much better resonance and body to the sound. The wood on my erhu seems too thick to contribute much resonance or other characteristics to the sound, but maybe it does not take much. I am sure though that a high-end erhu is going to be made of expensive wood since that is expected. No one wants to spend $1000 on a pear wood erhu. No builder would work as hard on a pear wood erhu as one made of sandalwood, nor will the snake skin be as select.
The practical side of the answer is that regardless of how important the wood selection is to the sound of an erhu, better erhus will be made from more expensive and rarer wood. There is a big difference in the sound of a $800 or so golden sandalwood erhu and a $200 redwood erhu. Is it due to the wood or other factors? Good question. Difficult to know for sure.
I am under the impression that erhus supposedly made of ebony are actually made of ebony sandalwood, which is not actually ebony but a dark variety of sandalwood. This is a good wood, if my erhu is any indication. Of course, any maker can use any wood, and call it what he likes, and it is difficult to know for sure.
All of the erhus I have seen used finished wood. Some really cheap erhus I saw a few months ago in San Francisco were painted, but I have not seen raw unfinished wood, if that is what you are asking about.
That was a lot of help, wasn't it? <g>
Best wishes,
David
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woods
Oct 24, 2005 5:51:56 GMT
Post by spansar on Oct 24, 2005 5:51:56 GMT
well, just ordered a golden sandalwood erhu from cadenza. took a good slice out of my savings. i must be insane. been suckered in by that "licentious" tone i've heard in so many recordings.
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woods
Oct 25, 2005 14:36:30 GMT
Post by YouLanFengChune on Oct 25, 2005 14:36:30 GMT
hi!
Relax. Cadenza Erhu is now linked to my music school. Your erhu is now verified not only by me, but by Singapore Chinese Orchestra Concert Master.
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woods
Oct 25, 2005 16:01:19 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Oct 25, 2005 16:01:19 GMT
well, just ordered a golden sandalwood erhu from cadenza. took a good slice out of my savings. i must be insane. been suckered in by that "licentious" tone i've heard in so many recordings. Wow, that's great! I am sure that you will be very happy with your erhu. I have been very happy with my ebony sandalwood from Cadenza. I hope to see yours someday. Do you ever get to Portland? Carlos Alden from Spokane sometimes visits. It would be fun to play trios. I would have an excuse to play my zhonghu. Together with my erhu teacher on gaohu, we could be a string orchestra. <g> Best wishes, David
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woods
Oct 25, 2005 22:52:22 GMT
Post by spansar on Oct 25, 2005 22:52:22 GMT
Thanks for the moral support you guys. I feel like I'm in good company! I'm excited about having the opportunity to learn how to sing with an erhu voice.
I travel to Portland once in a blue moon to visit family. I don't drive, however an Amtrak bus goes there and back everyday. I'm certainly interested in visiting! My playing would certainly benefit from personal guidance (I have never even seen a real erhu, let alone played one. I'll probably have become the first person in Clatsop County to own an erhu!)
-Spencer
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woods
Oct 31, 2005 4:33:17 GMT
Post by YouLanFengChune on Oct 31, 2005 4:33:17 GMT
Hi
I have an announcement to make.
As of 20th OCT 2005, Cadenza has successfully (yeah!!!) won a bid of consignment of prime snake skin from vietnam and burma, which will all be used for Erhus. It was originally meant to be sold into Europe for italian bags and shoes, but we figured it was too good a series of skin to give up, we loaned money to buy off all those skin. The lusture on the erhu skin is....golden shine, and even, and some scales are 9 mm wide.
The flip side is that the prices has to go up, and we have kept it to a basic minimum, and i hope the international market appreciate quality over frills and price.
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woods
Oct 31, 2005 16:29:07 GMT
Post by paulv on Oct 31, 2005 16:29:07 GMT
You guys are having a great time out there in the northwest -- I'm stuck here by myself in the northeast, playing alot of solos!!!
Regards
Paul Valente
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woods
Nov 2, 2005 19:11:13 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Nov 2, 2005 19:11:13 GMT
My most frequent opportunity for playing erhu with another musician is at my weekly lesson. Once in a while Carlos Alden visits and it is a lot of fun to jam on tunes. Otherwise, I play along with recordings of Chinese music. It is a lot of fun and is good training for the ear. The more I hear a tune played in tune, the easier it is for me to play it well.
I often use software on my computer to slow down the music enough that I can manage the speed and make sure the rhythm and tuning is accurate. It is sure a lot more fun than using a metronome and tuner. For some tunes that I am just learning, playing with a recording can be too much of a challenge. In this situation, I do like to use my tuner by setting a tone at the tonic note for the tune. This tone serves as a drone to play against. It is also useful for playing scales.
Playing music with others is more fun, but fortunately there are some useful learning tools when no one else is around.
Best wishes,
David
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woods
Nov 2, 2005 19:55:52 GMT
Post by paulv on Nov 2, 2005 19:55:52 GMT
I used to play along with my teacher, but since he is so good, his sound tends to drown out what I'm playing, and then I can't hear my mistakes.
David, how is your weekly erhu lesson going? I have a lesson every other week because I felt that once a week was too soon and once a month was too late.
I also has some software (I think from the same place that makes the metronome I've recommended) that does the same thing. I've thought about doing that, but never got around to it.
Right now I'm stuck with that fast passage in "Butterfly Lovers" -- my teacher wanted it faster than what I played last time. My fingers don't like to move quickly.
My teacher also told me to get rid of the spot I put at the octave position. I even told him that I saw a picture of Song Fei (famous erhu player in China) and she had a octave mark on her erhu. He still told me to get rid of it! He's right though, I was starting to become dependent on it.
Regards,
Paul Valente
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woods
Nov 2, 2005 20:40:15 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Nov 2, 2005 20:40:15 GMT
Good points, Paul. I would not want to play along with my teacher all of the time. He often plays a tune faster than I can manage. But I still think it is valuable since I get to be pushed and have to think fast. I also get to hear the tune played in tune and in correct style.
At one time I considered taking lessons every other week, but it is too much fun. I consider lessons a gift to myself when I get to focus on music I love with someone who knows the ropes. Even when I have not quite mastered a lesson, it is useful to get help and correction. The weekly schedule keeps me regular on a practice routine, since it is easier to get lazy for a day or two when there is a longer period between lessons. I admit that it is a challenge to keep up with everything. I take weekly lessons on dan bau as well. Who needs sleep anyway?
<g>
Best wishes,
David
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woods
Nov 2, 2005 21:43:28 GMT
Post by spansar on Nov 2, 2005 21:43:28 GMT
David do you have to travel far for your lessons? What's the going rate for them?
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 9:28:32 GMT
Post by YouLanFengChune on Nov 3, 2005 9:28:32 GMT
Paul, i agree with your teacher. I know Song Fei and her dad Song Guosheng personally. Song Fei got a lot of critism for that mark.
If you're playing butterfly lovers, you need a gaohu, don't you?
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 13:17:19 GMT
Post by paulv on Nov 3, 2005 13:17:19 GMT
The gaohu would be good, and also for playing "Fisherman Singing on the Boat at Dusk" (or whatever it's called). I need to somewhat be proficient on the erhu before I can think about doubling on some other huqin.
Regards, Paul Valente
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 13:23:16 GMT
Post by YouLanFengChune on Nov 3, 2005 13:23:16 GMT
You're right!
i'm working on a gaohu now. Eight sided oval gaohu. Its a new deign put forward by Yu Qiwei and several beijing masters.
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 13:43:19 GMT
Post by paulv on Nov 3, 2005 13:43:19 GMT
I thought if I ever decided to do a double, it would be a banhu. I really like the sound of a banhu and it's not as high as a jinghu, but we'll see. I still have at least another 2 years to go with the erhu before I can even think about it. For example, I've been practicing the fast part of Butterfly Lovers for almost 3 weeks now, and may have to cancel my lesson for this weekend because I'm still not ready.
Regards, Paul Valente
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 13:49:34 GMT
Post by paulv on Nov 3, 2005 13:49:34 GMT
Spencer, FYI, the going rate for private erhu lessons in the Boston, MA area is around $30/hr for a "good" teacher.
Regards, Paul Valente
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 18:05:23 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Nov 3, 2005 18:05:23 GMT
David do you have to travel far for your lessons? What's the going rate for them? I responded privately to spansar. If anyone else is interested, please contact me. Best wishes, David
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woods
Nov 3, 2005 18:23:10 GMT
Post by davidmdahl on Nov 3, 2005 18:23:10 GMT
I thought if I ever decided to do a double, it would be a banhu. I really like the sound of a banhu and it's not as high as a jinghu, but we'll see. I still have at least another 2 years to go with the erhu before I can even think about it. For example, I've been practicing the fast part of Butterfly Lovers for almost 3 weeks now, and may have to cancel my lesson for this weekend because I'm still not ready. Regards, Paul Valente I have heard recordings of banhu that were appealing. The only one I have played was pretty harsh-sounding. It may not have been set up properly, so I may not have had a chance to give it a fair test. I do tend to prefer a lower range, so the zhonghu is more my cup of tea. All the same, I am focusing my huqin efforts on the erhu. There is certainly plenty to do. Regarding cancelling your lesson, I can understand the sentiment, but I suggest going anyway. I consider everything I am studying to be a work-in-progress. On very few occasions have I been really happy with the way I have played something at my lesson. It sure can go better practicing at home. <g> When you are struggling with a tune, a good teacher can often provide good tips for getting through the difficulties, and save you trouble in the long run. Good luck with it! Best wishes, David
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